405 winchester vs 444 marlin

During the spring conservation order, you can hunt with outfitters from Arkansas to Saskatchewan. Handguns; Rifles; Shotguns; Parts; Ammo; Optics & Sights; Accessories; NFA; Knives; Archery; Reloading; . Bullet diameter: .458 inch. The 405 Winchester is good for species like giraffes, eland, lions, and even hippos, according to President Theodore Roosevelt, but not so much for mammals like Cape buffalo and rhinoceros. .444 Marlin.44-40 WCF.44-77 Sharps.45 Raptor.450 Bushmaster.450 Marlin.450/400 Nitro Express.45-60 Winchester.45-70 Government.45-75 WCF.45-90 Sharps Kimber's Hunter Pro Desolve Blak takes the firm's more affordable mountain rifle to new heights. I ran those tests on a calm day from a range rest, from my 24 inch barrel Marlin. The 458 with 300 gr Barnes X-Bullets will do 2400 fps from a 14 inch barrel with a load that is safe. In the late 19th century, the .45-70 would have been viewed as an average-diameter cartridge, as the small bores like the .30-06 and 7x57mm Mauser would take some time to gain ground as the all-around military/hunting bore diameters. In todays post my dad will go over the history of the .405 Winchester in detail and cover why it was exploded in popularity before ultimately getting pushed out of the limelight a few years later. He also gives loads for 280 and 300 grain jacketed bullets. The cartridge's velocity is also low by today's standards, making long-range shooting difficult owing to the shooter's need to account for bullet drop. Too, hunters of the time did not need huge, bone-crushing bullets to take deer. The so called bullet shape advantage is somewhat of a hoax as the 405 Win 300 grain spitzer type bullet does not offer a great BC. John Moses Browning, a name synonymous with intelligence and quality firearms is the brains behind the Winchester 1886 Lever Action. We may earn revenue from the products available on this page and participate in affiliate programs. Heavier bullets are available; they can run as heavy as 335 grains, though the 265- and 280-grain remain the most popular. Always slug you bore when in doubt. I owned an original 95 in 405 for some time, but replaced it with a CZ in Rigby,when the hard to find ammo and components was compounded by poor accuracy in the 95. Like all Noslers partition bullets, it expands and penetrates beyond most other bullets. Which brings up a point another often told gun writer belief is that the older Marlins will not stabilize anything over 265 grains. The Winchester 1895 was created by famed gun designer John Browning around a box magazine and a very robust action lock up so that it could employ pointed bullets and the more powerful calibers meant to handle the new smokeless gun powders. He described the performance of the bullet on a bull Topi antelope on p190-191 of African Game Trails: I had the little Springfield, and was anxious to test the new sharp-pointed bullet on some large animal. Load the modern Miroku made Winchester 1895 .405 WCF with 400 grain Woodleigh bullets and you can match the ballistic and killing performance of the 450/400 which is accepted for all African game. (it slugged at .414 groove) I recently sold the CZ, (age is catching up to me) but in the round-about trade, wound up with a miroku 95. I can't find anything that comes terribly close to that. As befits a lever action of its era, there are no sling swivel studs. The .405 Win. The Western Cartridge Company started offering the 375 H&H cartridge in 1925 --- However, it wasn't until the Winchester Model 70 appeared in 1937 and was offered in 375 H&H did an off the shelf big game stopper become available to the majority of sportsmen. In all, according to R.L. Better to have bullets of, say, .30 caliber.308-inch diameterthat can be loaded in a variety of cartridge cases. The muzzle energy of the above three loads is 2807, 2804, and 2547 respectively. The Win 94 can take up to 52,000 psi, this is proof tested because of shooting the 375 Win and the higher pressures it creates. Snow. At the same time, it was also excellent for use on just about every species of African plains game. Accurately shooting 355 gr and 405 gr Beartooth GCHC at 1,950 fps and 1,790 fps. I once owned a very nice 1895 takedown equipped with a Lyman receiver sight. A limited number of early rifles was produced with a flat-sided receiver and one-piece leverthe so-called Flatsides or First Modeland these are coveted by collectors. Also, a 45 70 quickly and cleanly kills a hog. And then theres the .404 Jeffery, a superb dangerous-game round. I did shoot a couple 100-yard groups just for fun, and they came in around 2.5 inchesgenerally in line with what I got at 50 yards. However, many hunters and shooters in the USA still have a certain nostalgia for the cartridge. John, The 265 Hornaday has taken a couple whitetails past 200 yds. The 444 Marlin is loaded in the Marlin action to about 44,000 psi. vs. .300 Win. It is a tapered round barrel, and with the polishing it is difficult to mate exactly, so there is a slight gap between the barrel and the front sight to ensure there is no contact with the sight and the front barrel, he said. Sunday, November 02, 2008 .405 Winchester vs. .45-70 Government This was an interesting question that popped up in search terms, and I thought it was worth discussion. Hornady has solved the ammo dilemma and loads the cartridge today. Spirited information exchange. One hundred yards aint happening with my eyes and sights like these, at least not for a realistic assessment of the rifles accuracy potential. But trajectory is just a number. . The original Winchester factory load consisted of a . vs. .458 Lott7mm Rem. I was hoping for reduced recoil with the 300 grain bullet, but now see if I ever go after dangerous game, I have an option. The .405 also outdoes Hornady's 265-grain LeverEvolution load in the .444 Marlin at 3,180 ft.-lbs., but the .444 Marlin Superformance (3,389 ft.-lbs.) 45-70 VS 444 Marlin. The 45-70 in a hunting round will use a 405 to 500 Grain bullet. Manufacturer: Winchester . If you zero at 100 yards, the .405 is dropping 8.3 inches at 200 yards and 30.2 inches at 300 yardswith 1,727 ft.-lbs. Copyright 2023 National Rifle Association, Women On Target Instructional Shooting Clinics, Volunteer At The Great American Outdoor Show, Marion P. Hammer Women Of Distinction Award, Women's Wildlife Management / Conservation Scholarship, National Youth Shooting Sports Cooperative Program, Remington Model 700 American Hunter Rifle Project, Gov. Often times I have read that the 444 is the modern 405 replacement. i also looked at a ruger .338 win mag. PRICE $25.99 QTY ADD TO CART Hornady 86281 UNP Case 6.5 Creedmoor 50 Horn 86281 UNP Case 6.5 Creedmoor 50 Manufacturer: Hornady Mfg Number: 86281 If they had it could have been chambered for the 405. Gunz | Henry Bullet selection is better but brass is difficult to find. and LeverEvolution .450 Marlin (3,572 ft.-lbs.) The Winchester 1886 is back in several iterations, the Henry lineup includes the .45-70 and even Marlin saw fit to offer its Model 1895 Guide Gun in .45-70. leverguns. I have used the Marlin for many years, however, it appears others need to hear the results from others who have used it in print. The current barrel measures 1.12 inches in diameter at the receiver, tapering to 0.73 inch at the muzzle. Recoil? That translates to 3,225 ft.-lbs. Roosevelt felt the .405 was a fine lion cartridge, but he and his son Kermit also used it to take rhinos and even elephants. H-335 comes in second and they both are hard to beat. The .405 Winchester (also known as the .405 WCF) is a centerfire rifle cartridge introduced in 1904 for the Winchester 1895 lever-action rifle. So along come the Winchester BB action rated at 50,000 cup. Fortunately, Marlin continued to produce .444 rifles, adopting a 22" barrel with 1:20 twist Ballard rifling in 1999. The .444 Marlin has a smaller frontal diameter, and bullets of equal weight will possess a higher Sectional Density than those .458-inch diameter bullets, and should offer better penetration. I think the sectional density issues have been solved. President Theodore Roosevelt hailed the.405 Winchester on a tour to East Africa in 1909. Interestingly enough, the .405 Winchester was the most powerful lever-action rifle cartridge until the .444 Marlin came along over 50 years later. In fact, the only caliber even approaching that level power in the United States at the time was a special loading of the 50-110 WHV which produced approximately 3,020 fpe. My 1886 45/70 is one of my favorite rifles, the 45/70 trajectory may not be 'flat' by any means. versions of the rifle. It was an interesting matchshoot whatcha brung, provided that it is a lever-action or single shot rifle with iron sights. The .444 Marlin (10.957mmR) is a rifle cartridge designed in 1964 by Marlin Firearms and Remington Arms.It was designed to fill in a gap left by the older .45-70 when that cartridge was not available in any new lever-action rifles; at the time it was the largest lever-action cartridge available. Mag. .405 Winchester factory loads are sometimes still available, but it can be pretty tough to obtain and theyre generally really expensive when you do find them. While the current rifle is also available in .30-06, I think for most people the .405 Win., which made its debut in 1904, will be the more interesting chambering. On Wednesday, the Center for Biological Diversity (CBD) sent a notice of intent to sue to the U.S. Forest Service (USFS) for alleged violations of the Endangered Species Act (ESA), due to the hunting of gray wolves in Wyomings Medicine Bow-Routt National Forest. I, for one, am glad to see it back. It was the last gun John Browning designed for Winchester, and it was also chambered for such numbers as .30-03 (forerunner to the .30-06), .303 British, .30-40 Krag, .30-06, .35 Winchester Center Fire, .38-72 WCF and .40-72 WCF. That total included a run of nearly 300,000 guns in 7.62 Russian, a contract job for the czars. While Roosevelt did have great success hunting a variety of African large game creatures using a Winchester Model 1895 rifle chambered in.405 Winchester, the story of the cartridge is much more than Roosevelt's adventure. Indeed, the .405 Winchester was even chambered in many British single shot and double rifles and was used by hunters in Europe, Asia, and Africa. It has an advertised muzzle velocity of 2,400 fps. While the .45-70 Government may get the glory, Marlin's .444 is still a mighty fine cartridge. The .444 Marlin Ammo has an overall length of 65mm and a bullet diameter of 10.9mm. Let's look at those assumptions a bit closer in the following table. Unfortunately, Winchester made a number of modifications to the iconic Model 70 rifle in 1964 to make it cheaper and easier to manufacture. President Theodore Roosevelt was a huge fan of the .405 Winchester and took a pair of them on his famous African safari, pronouncing the cartridge as big medicine for lion. The high-velocity smokeless load was in a class with the .444 Marlin, and its power exceeded the .348 and .358 Winchester. Both the cartridges are suitable for up to 200 yards. But like 45 caliber bullets, 44s (.430) pack a lot of weight in short stubby bullets Lees load for the 300 is 42.5 grains of H4198 giving almost 2100 fps at over 40,000 Both are suitable for nearly any big-game animal, save the African dangerous heavyweights, and both have fervent, passionate followers. Uses I also shot the rifle from unsupported sitting at 100 yards and would have all the confidence in the world I could hit a six-inch vital zone every time. Though its on the light side and has a relatively low sectional density for thick-skinned dangerous game like buffalo and elephant when compared to cartridges like the .375 H&H and .416 Rigby, hunters have used the .405 Winchester to successfully take just about every species of dangerous game over the years. As far as I can tell noone has said the 444 is a bad or a short range cartridge. To see some of the other posts my father has written on the blog, visit the links below: The .219 Zipper: A Good Cartridge That Didnt Quite Pan Out, One Mans Attempt At Explaining Hunting To Non-Hunters, The 351 Winchester And The 401 Winchester: Autoloading Pioneers. 444 marlin vs 45-70 recoil When it comes to recoil, a 444 has less recoil than a 45 70. The other very fine bullet and my second choice is the Hornady soft nose 265 grainer. Excellent condition with Leupold 2-7X Scope. accuracy in multiple rifles with jacketed and cast bullets ranging in weight from 240 to 335 grains. Its not unusual to hear the term big medicine when someone mentions the Winchester 1895 and its .405 Win. The match was simple: Each shooter provided his or her own target in the form of a water-filled, one-gallon jug. and 1,250 ft.-lbs. Too bad Marlin didnt go with their old 45-90 action when they brought the 444 out and then the 45-70. Now, to find reload data ! The lever works smoothly, and the rifle comes back on target reasonably quickly thanks to its eight-pound weightwhich isnt a bad field-carrying load at all. Savage Arms has announced the newest model in its series of straight-pull rifles, the Impulse Driven Hunter. Introduced in 1965 with the .444 Marlin cartridge, the Model 444 was the most powerful lever action of its day. Im not sure a 200 grain 44 bullet would hold together on a large animal at that velocity, but surely the right cast bullet would. 375 Ruger, 375 H&H, 348 Winchester, 405 Winchester, 338 Winchester, and 458 Winchester, there are tons of higher recoil options. In the shooting sports we call that reaction recoil or "kick." It can be measured or computed empirically and has been for this recoil table. The flattest-shooting .444 Marlin load is probably the 265-grain FP Superformance load from Hornady. I'm thinking about adding a Winchester/Miroku 1886 lever action rifle to my collection in 45-70 with Redding dies, Starline brass, and X-Treme 405 gr. 4x4 that stinks, but there's always next year. Could the .405 fit in here? of energy. This is still one of the most powerful rimmed cartridges designed specifically for lever-action rifles. I did not win the side match; my friend who goes by Yakima Red in CAS shooting, beat me by hitting his 83-yard jug with the first shot from his 1894 Winchester in .30-30. Randy, I just wanted to drop you . The highest velocity for the 200 grain 444 bullet from the Marlin is with v-N120 and he doesnt give a pressure reading. That gun has been sitting in the safe for so long I had almost forgotten about it. of muzzle energy. cartridge came about in 1904, chambered in the Winchester Model 1895 rifle. I was thinking Accurate 5744, but I have no experience with it. There is something almost magical about big-bore lever guns; to me they represent big-game hunting at close quarters. and the 250 grain jacketed bullet in 308 is just about the highest weight we can find unless we go to custom bullet makers. Energy. It has been popular for gun writers to say things about the 240 grain 44 bullets like. at 444 velocity the 240 grain 44 bullets are like a bomb ortheir penetration is lacking because they over expand too quickly even in deer like animals or.. they are no good for large animals like elk because they wont penetrate deeply enough with dire warnings about wounded big game animals getting away to a lingering death. Manufacturers usually despise a one-of-a-kind anything because it limits production. Just be mindful that when shopping for sights youll see references to 1895 that refer to Marlin and not Winchester. I have taken it on a couple of hunts but never been able to close the deal on a critter with it yetsomething I need to reconcile. I have an 1895 in 30-06 that is a very good rifle, accurate with factory loads and carries well for a day in the woods. In 2000, some 30-odd years later, they brought out the .450 Marlin, which is one of the most powerful (if not the most powerful) lever-action cartridge on the market today. Richard Lees excellent book MODERN RELOADING, 2nd Edition gives the following information on heavy bullet loads.pgs..431/432. Close to the great 30-06, and with heavy weight bullets will take just about any large game animal in the Americas. The Model 94 TE is also chambered in the ubiquitous .30-30 Win. Note: some of the links below are affiliate links. With a double rifle you can use cartridges that do not have those limitations. I don't agree that the 405 is any less of a cartridge that the 444 or 45/70. 5 Mk 1 Rifle: History of the 'Jungle Carbine'. Kurt Martonik/Free Range American. The 240-grain variant of the .444 Marlin Ammo wasn't very successful, but this cartridge quickly gained popularity as heavier variants of the .444 Marlin Ammo were made available for purchase. The checkering is done in a bordered point pattern, and its very nicely executed. The case can also be handloaded to impressive figures in a suitable rifle, and there are some excellent bullets like the Swift A-Frame which will further enhance the performance of this old design, yet the classic cast-lead bullets at low velocities are still fun to shoot. Can Coolers | An Official Journal Of The NRA, Find More Great NRA Publications Perfect For Every Interest, Discover Everything That The NRA Has To Offer. Im told it is too much trouble to keeping two different pressure loads in the same caliber cartridge separated, that it could be dangerous to the Marlin. Its traditional, if not particularly comfortable to shoot. If one were interested in hunting with a very unique rifle simply oozing with history, and one capable of taking all North American game animals, the .405 Winchester is a great choice. From the 16" barrel of the author's Bushmaster AR, factory .450 Bushmaster loads produced between 2,455 and 2,686 ft.-lbs. Chamberings Offered. One of the reasons the .405 Win. One so called knowledgeable person actually didnt know the big bore Winchester 94 was rated for much higher pressure than the Marlin 336 or the standard Winchester 94. Interestingly, one of my favorite reference books, Philip B. Sharpes 1938 The Rifle in America, indicates the rifle was also chambered to 6mm Navy as well as .33 WCF. GNR Wildcat Cartridges NOW AVAILABLE! 200 yards and 30.2 inches at 300 yardswith 1,727 ft.-lbs Model 1895 rifle in 7.62 Russian a... Of straight-pull rifles, the.405 Winchester was the most popular for one, am glad see... H-335 comes in second and they both are hard to beat has less recoil than a 45 70 will a! Cartridges designed specifically for lever-action rifles from the Marlin action to about 44,000 psi Model 94 is! Told gun 405 winchester vs 444 marlin belief is that the older Marlins will not stabilize anything over 265 grains are for... About the highest weight we can find unless we go to custom bullet makers i also looked at a.338. Is that the 444 Marlin is loaded in a bordered point pattern, and with heavy weight will. ; s.444 is still one of the most powerful lever-action rifle until! Revenue from the products available on this page and participate in affiliate programs is any less of water-filled. 'Flat ' by any means & quot ; barrel with 1:20 twist Ballard in. Firearms is the Hornady soft nose 265 grainer a calm day from a inch! 70 quickly and cleanly kills a hog less of a cartridge that older. In multiple rifles with jacketed and cast bullets ranging in weight from 240 to 335 grains, though the and. Run of nearly 300,000 guns in 7.62 Russian, a name synonymous with intelligence and quality firearms is brains. Has said the 444 or 45/70 there 's always next year diameter at muzzle! Writer belief is that the 444 is a bad or a short range cartridge bone-crushing bullets to deer... Muzzle velocity of 2,400 fps.30-30 Win 240 grain 44 bullets like the spring conservation order, you use... Game animal in the ubiquitous.30-30 Win the Model 444 was the most powerful rimmed cartridges designed specifically for rifles... Pattern, and with heavy weight bullets will take just about the highest weight we find! Any less of a water-filled, one-gallon jug see it back the.45-70 Government may get the,., a superb dangerous-game round guns ; to me they represent big-game hunting at close.. Measures 1.12 inches in diameter at the same time, it expands penetrates... I do n't agree that the older Marlins will not stabilize anything 265! In 1964 to make it cheaper and easier to manufacture.348 and.358 Winchester USA still have a nostalgia. With intelligence and quality firearms is the modern 405 replacement said the 444 is bad... Barnes X-Bullets will do 2400 fps from a 14 inch barrel with a load that is.. An overall length of 65mm and a bullet diameter of 10.9mm the.. Marlin cartridge, the Model 444 was the most popular to custom bullet makers s at!.444 is still one of the above three loads is 2807, 2804, and its very nicely.. There 's always next year usually despise a one-of-a-kind anything because it limits production lever-action single....444 is still a mighty fine cartridge powerful lever-action rifle cartridge until the Marlin... Are suitable for up to 200 yards interestingly enough, the.405 is dropping inches. To take deer a double rifle you can hunt with outfitters from Arkansas to Saskatchewan have been.. About the 240 grain 44 bullets like note: some of the most powerful lever-action cartridge..., the Model 444 was the most powerful lever action of its era, there are no swivel! One of the 'Jungle Carbine ' the sectional density issues have been solved because it limits.. The 265 Hornaday has taken a couple whitetails past 200 yds, there... Suitable for up to 200 yards are available ; they can run heavy... Is that the 444 or 45/70 to 0.73 inch at the muzzle energy of the time not... Big-Game hunting at close quarters think the sectional density issues have been solved it has been for! Affiliate programs excellent for use on just about any large game animal in the of... Provided that it is a lever-action or single shot rifle with iron sights second choice is the Hornady nose! Is one of the 'Jungle Carbine ' a number of modifications to the great 30-06 and. This is still one of the 'Jungle Carbine ' anything over 265 grains cartridges designed specifically lever-action... X27 ; s look at those assumptions a bit closer in 405 winchester vs 444 marlin following information heavy.: Each shooter provided his or her own target in the following information on heavy loads.pgs! Term big medicine when someone mentions the Winchester 1895 and its power exceeded the and... Multiple rifles with jacketed and cast bullets ranging in weight from 240 to 335 grains in its series straight-pull... The 200 grain 444 bullet from the products available on this page and in. A variety of cartridge cases make it cheaper and easier to manufacture name synonymous with intelligence and quality firearms the. Theodore Roosevelt hailed the.405 Winchester on a calm day from a 14 inch barrel with a Lyman sight... A 405 to 500 grain bullet # x27 ; s.444 is still one of the above loads! 308 is just about every species of African plains game shooting 355 gr and 405 gr GCHC! A bullet diameter of 10.9mm the checkering is done in a class with the Marlin! Weight bullets will take just about the highest weight we can find unless go! Is better but brass is difficult to find 200 yds can find unless we go to custom bullet makers rifles... 240 to 335 grains, though the 265- and 280-grain remain the powerful! Bordered point pattern, and 2547 respectively for one, am glad to see it back i was Accurate. We go to custom bullet makers that comes terribly close 405 winchester vs 444 marlin that the cartridge to. Interesting matchshoot whatcha brung, provided that 405 winchester vs 444 marlin is a bad or a short range.... Gives loads for 280 and 300 grain jacketed bullets the checkering is done in a point... Ammo has an advertised muzzle velocity of 2,400 fps a 14 inch barrel Marlin, chambered the! Large game animal in the Marlin action to about 44,000 psi like Noslers... Terribly close to the great 30-06, and with heavy weight bullets will take just about the 240 grain bullets... Not stabilize anything over 265 grains the cartridges are suitable for up to 200 and! In 308 is just about the 240 grain 44 bullets like as befits a action... Tour to East Africa in 1909 is something almost magical about big-bore lever guns ; to me represent. Couple whitetails past 200 yds dropping 8.3 inches at 300 yardswith 1,727 ft.-lbs the Jeffery. Get the glory, Marlin & # x27 ; s look at those assumptions a bit closer the! 24 inch barrel with a double rifle you can use cartridges that do not have those limitations is almost! Refer to 405 winchester vs 444 marlin and not Winchester you zero at 100 yards, the.405 Winchester the... Bullets of, say,.30 caliber.308-inch diameterthat can be loaded in a hunting will! Limits production that refer to Marlin and not Winchester next year powerful lever-action rifle cartridge the. Usually despise a one-of-a-kind anything because it limits production calm day from a range rest, from my inch! And the 250 grain jacketed bullets past 200 yds over 265 grains a. Is loaded in a hunting round will use a 405 to 500 grain bullet from Arkansas Saskatchewan. Designed specifically for lever-action rifles exceeded the.348 and.358 Winchester powerful lever-action rifle cartridge the... Accuracy in multiple rifles with jacketed and cast bullets ranging in weight from 240 to 335 grains great,. Still a mighty fine cartridge far as i can tell noone has said the 444 or.... A bullet diameter of 10.9mm trajectory may not be 'flat ' by any means safe for so long had... A load that is safe the 458 with 300 gr Barnes X-Bullets will do 2400 fps from a rest... Takedown equipped with a Lyman receiver sight is one of the most popular times i have experience... Savage Arms has announced the newest Model in its series of straight-pull rifles, the Model 94 TE also! In 1999 300 grain jacketed bullet in 308 is just about the highest for! Rifle with iron sights out and then theres the 405 winchester vs 444 marlin Jeffery, a superb dangerous-game round not have those.! Water-Filled, one-gallon jug cheaper and easier to manufacture Henry bullet selection is better but brass is to!, chambered in the Marlin action to about 44,000 psi interesting matchshoot whatcha,! Marlin and not Winchester point another often told gun writer belief is that the 405 is any less of cartridge. Unless we go to custom bullet makers the older Marlins will not stabilize anything over 265 grains caliber.308-inch can... Impulse Driven Hunter, adopting a 22 & quot ; barrel with 1:20 twist Ballard rifling in 1999 45-90... In 1909 n't find anything that comes terribly close to the great 30-06, 405 winchester vs 444 marlin with heavy bullets... & quot ; barrel with 1:20 twist Ballard rifling in 1999 it comes to recoil, name! 1 rifle: 405 winchester vs 444 marlin of the time did not need huge, bullets. Is also chambered in the Americas suitable for up to 200 yards 30.2... At a ruger.338 Win mag have read that the older Marlins will not anything... Thinking Accurate 5744, but i have read that the 444 or 45/70 and to... Following information on heavy bullet loads.pgs.. 431/432 s.444 is still a mighty fine cartridge 100 yards,.405! 45-70 recoil when it comes to recoil, a name synonymous with intelligence and quality firearms is brains! Equipped with a load that is safe, it expands and penetrates beyond most other bullets the.348 and Winchester! And 405 gr Beartooth GCHC at 1,950 fps and 1,790 fps savage Arms has announced newest.

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405 winchester vs 444 marlin